WEBVTT 00:00.000 --> 00:16.000 Okay, so, hello everybody, I'm, I'm Geron Poisson, I'm also known as Gophie on 00:16.000 --> 00:23.000 Internet, I'm an example of developer for more than 15 years, I'm a author and a 00:23.000 --> 00:28.000 little developer of the developer, which is all in one communication tool based on 00:28.000 --> 00:34.000 XMPP, I'm a member of the XMPP standard foundation for 10 years and I'm an 00:34.000 --> 00:42.000 electing member of the XMPP standard foundation council for this 2025 term, which is a 00:42.000 --> 00:47.000 team, which is taking the technical decision in the XMPP standard foundation. 00:47.000 --> 00:54.000 So, my goal today is to show you that XMPP is not only a great messaging protocol, 00:54.000 --> 01:00.000 it can also be used as a layer to make other tools, and it can simplify your 01:00.000 --> 01:05.000 life if you want to make a sketch with it. So, really quick, so Maria, for this XMPP, 01:05.000 --> 01:11.000 XMPP stands for extensive messaging and presents protocol, it was, as is 01:11.000 --> 01:18.000 name say, initially sought for a sort messaging, but since, thanks to the XMPP, 01:18.000 --> 01:25.000 it can do a lot of things nowadays. It was introduced in the late 90s, it's 20 01:25.000 --> 01:32.000 six years old this year, it's widely used, many people use it with a lot of 01:32.000 --> 01:38.000 annoying it, because it's, it's a base in zoom, it's original protocol in 01:38.000 --> 01:44.000 what's up, it's shows in a mini application, a mini video games, it's used a lot, 01:44.000 --> 01:50.000 and it has a good story of a lot of compatibility and protection, if you take 01:50.000 --> 01:55.000 XMPP client, which was met 15 years ago, and without being touch, it 01:55.000 --> 02:00.000 should watch, without modern feature, of course, but it should work with 02:00.000 --> 02:05.000 modern server. So, we will start with instant messaging use 02:05.000 --> 02:10.000 case. Let's imagine you want to make a script with a super useful 02:10.000 --> 02:16.000 box, which it's time to see for them in a chat, it had a reaction with a beer 02:16.000 --> 02:21.000 and a fan fries. So, you want this box to work, of course, with the most 02:21.000 --> 02:28.000 popular chat application out there, which is what the box, and to do that, you 02:28.000 --> 02:32.000 go on the website, and you have to check for the API, if you are lucky, 02:32.000 --> 02:37.000 it's a library, that is available for the programming language you want to use, 02:37.000 --> 02:40.000 then you have to learn the library to documentation, to some 02:40.000 --> 02:43.000 experimentation, see all you get the message, all you do 02:43.000 --> 02:47.000 reaction, etc., etc., and you do an application. Okay, now you have 02:47.000 --> 02:51.000 something working with a laptop, and you want to undo the second 02:51.000 --> 02:55.000 most popular application, the chat application there, which is 02:55.000 --> 02:59.000 a small signal. So, small signal, same thing, you go there, you 02:59.000 --> 03:03.000 change the IPI, there is no library, so you have to go with the IPI, 03:03.000 --> 03:07.000 you have to do the authentication, maybe on the hand-to-hand encryption, 03:07.000 --> 03:14.000 and learn experiment, etc., etc. So, when you did your 03:14.000 --> 03:17.000 second implementation, the first one, the pre-cat is 03:17.000 --> 03:21.000 IPI because this proprietary software, so it's bad, and so you have to 03:21.000 --> 03:25.000 start again from scratch and do a new implementation with a new 03:25.000 --> 03:28.000 application on the IPI. Then there is a sort of application, but 03:28.000 --> 03:32.000 I will stop there because more a fantasy is not realistic to 03:32.000 --> 03:35.000 have three major different and incompatible chat 03:35.000 --> 03:40.000 application you use by many people. So, what the solution to 03:40.000 --> 03:45.000 that, if you have guessed, you can use XMPP, with XMPP and 03:45.000 --> 03:48.000 the gateway, which translate to other protocols, you do 03:48.000 --> 03:52.000 the implementation only once, so you just have to do the 03:52.000 --> 03:57.000 execution and ending on incoming message. Once, and the gateway 03:57.000 --> 04:01.000 will handle the different protocols. What is interesting with that is 04:01.000 --> 04:04.000 if there is yet another application, it just needs to be 04:04.000 --> 04:07.000 implementing the gateway and do not have to change anything in 04:07.000 --> 04:10.000 your script, it will still be working. If there is a new version of the 04:10.000 --> 04:15.000 IPI, the gateway will not change that, and when it's on your 04:15.000 --> 04:20.000 example, if we will work out of the box without having to 04:20.000 --> 04:23.000 change anything from your site, and I have two good news. The 04:23.000 --> 04:27.000 first one is a separate gateway exists, it's called 04:27.000 --> 04:32.000 slidge, and it's ending most of the most popular chat 04:32.000 --> 04:36.000 application, and the second thing, it's not only working with 04:36.000 --> 04:40.000 insort messaging, you can do that with any kind of 04:40.000 --> 04:45.000 things. So, why would you use XMPP for building your 04:45.000 --> 04:48.000 two? I put a lot of text in the, I will be quick because 04:48.000 --> 04:51.000 you will see a few minutes, but you can check after 04:51.000 --> 04:54.000 the text if you want the slidge out available online. 04:54.000 --> 04:58.000 So, as we have seen, if you do implementation, you only do 04:58.000 --> 05:01.000 it once. One use XMPP, it's a coherent 05:01.000 --> 05:04.000 system, so you use always the St. mechanism, the 05:04.000 --> 05:08.000 St. Why to use identifior of the St. Why to use 05:08.000 --> 05:13.000 XMPP? You'll use other specification, etc. It's 05:13.000 --> 05:16.000 It's flexible, and example, it does a lot for you. 05:16.000 --> 05:20.840 It's under already authentication, and to an encryption. 05:20.840 --> 05:24.000 The generic tools you can use to my commands, 05:24.000 --> 05:27.480 or to send and get a notification, et cetera, et cetera. 05:27.480 --> 05:31.800 And the gateway takes a burden of two. 05:31.800 --> 05:36.440 So if you have the gateway for the protocol you want to use, 05:36.440 --> 05:39.160 you just have to concentrate on the feature you want to implement 05:39.160 --> 05:40.480 with an example. 05:40.480 --> 05:43.760 And in some case, you can even improve the feature 05:43.760 --> 05:47.600 you have, for instance, with the Atom or RSS. 05:47.600 --> 05:51.280 The feature you have in newspaper, for instance, 05:51.280 --> 05:55.160 you only get you item when you pull the feed. 05:55.160 --> 05:57.120 But if there is an implementation, which 05:57.120 --> 05:58.920 is using the moving for instance, 05:58.920 --> 06:01.320 while using an example, it helps serve. 06:01.320 --> 06:03.240 And in this case, you can get notification, 06:03.240 --> 06:08.840 whereas there is no article without having to pull it by yourself. 06:08.840 --> 06:14.280 A quick call done on the XMPP software foundation is organized. 06:14.280 --> 06:16.120 The XMPP standard, the standard software, 06:16.120 --> 06:17.640 so standard foundation is organized. 06:17.640 --> 06:20.080 So the XMPP standard foundation is what 06:20.080 --> 06:21.520 handled administrative things 06:21.520 --> 06:26.360 and the organization of specification. 06:26.360 --> 06:28.640 So you can, if you involve some moving XMPP, 06:28.640 --> 06:31.080 because you want a client of standard running things, 06:31.080 --> 06:32.520 you cannot play to be a member. 06:32.520 --> 06:34.880 And there is a vote, it's fully aware that somebody 06:34.880 --> 06:38.960 is part accepted, it's fully extremized. 06:38.960 --> 06:40.680 But you don't have to be a member if you want 06:40.680 --> 06:43.640 to work with a proper specification, 06:43.640 --> 06:45.320 and obviously to use it. 06:45.320 --> 06:47.320 There is a standard mailing list where you 06:47.320 --> 06:52.520 we discuss, we have feedback about stuff proposed. 06:52.520 --> 06:54.280 That's really interesting, because we have feedback 06:54.280 --> 06:57.760 from people with values, experience, software developers, 06:57.760 --> 07:02.080 people working on video people working on encryption, et cetera. 07:02.080 --> 07:06.120 And with all these eyes, we can have, 07:06.120 --> 07:10.200 with a time-good solution, which is sustainable. 07:10.200 --> 07:11.760 There is a message, just before the first day, 07:11.760 --> 07:15.520 we have today of XMPP Summit, where we need face-to-face. 07:15.520 --> 07:19.920 And we can discuss many things and see the faces behind the software. 07:19.920 --> 07:23.200 The XSF board is administrative, the team 07:23.200 --> 07:24.720 with attacking administrative decision, 07:24.720 --> 07:28.360 and the XSF Council is a team tackling the technical decision. 07:28.360 --> 07:31.960 So a quick overview, if you have a specific assure, 07:31.960 --> 07:34.480 and you go to the XMPP Summit, just to be accepted, 07:34.480 --> 07:37.720 then there is a secure, wide-go-to-standar mailing list 07:37.720 --> 07:40.000 for a feedback, you have a bit of a specific assure, 07:40.000 --> 07:42.560 and it goes to the console, et cetera, 07:42.560 --> 07:47.920 until you have a stable and good specification. 07:47.920 --> 07:53.440 Wires are shows that it's to see that we're 07:53.440 --> 07:57.280 mixing to avoid duplication, and to keep the sync as long 07:57.280 --> 07:59.240 and sustainable as possible. 07:59.240 --> 08:04.640 If we have a feature, we try to make it work for long, 08:04.640 --> 08:13.160 so if you're on it, you show more that it will work for long. 08:13.160 --> 08:17.560 OK, there is a criticism that I often hear about XMPP. 08:17.560 --> 08:22.000 There is two main examples, XMPP extension protocol. 08:22.000 --> 08:26.480 It's a specific action we do for every feature. 08:26.480 --> 08:30.960 And it may be difficult for software to understand that. 08:30.960 --> 08:34.480 So for that's wrong, because we have a good discovery mechanism, 08:34.480 --> 08:37.920 so we can know which feature is supported by the other entities. 08:37.920 --> 08:40.240 And it works. 08:40.240 --> 08:44.720 And the XMPP are, actually, similar to the Unix philosophy. 08:44.720 --> 08:49.600 So every example we want to see and try to do it well. 08:49.600 --> 08:55.960 And we reuse the XMPP or other protocols, 08:55.960 --> 08:59.720 for instance, we have blogging in our XMPP, 08:59.720 --> 09:03.520 and we use Atom, which is existing specification, 09:03.520 --> 09:05.720 and instead of reinventing the wheel, 09:05.720 --> 09:08.400 we just reuse stuff, which already exists. 09:08.400 --> 09:11.280 And so they play nicely together. 09:11.280 --> 09:14.160 And what is also useful is a specific action. 09:14.160 --> 09:16.560 It's actually a documentation. 09:16.560 --> 09:18.480 So if you want to make something, and you 09:18.480 --> 09:22.360 don't know where to start, you can just check the specification, 09:22.360 --> 09:26.560 and you will see, oh, it works. 09:26.560 --> 09:28.600 And we have precious information. 09:28.600 --> 09:30.680 There's always security consideration for that, 09:30.680 --> 09:33.640 so you can use your phone to control your robot. 09:33.640 --> 09:36.480 PAPSAB is published in subscribe. 09:36.480 --> 09:40.120 It's feature when you can publish information, 09:40.120 --> 09:43.520 in a list, and you can it manage 09:43.520 --> 09:47.120 the subscription notification, it may not 09:47.120 --> 09:48.920 permission management. 09:48.920 --> 09:51.480 And there's a new feature of hierarchy, 09:51.480 --> 09:56.600 where you can have a graph and any kind of things. 09:56.600 --> 10:02.000 And so it's useful for anything, for many, many, many things. 10:02.000 --> 10:04.840 I don't need a notification, I don't understand. 10:04.840 --> 10:08.440 For instance, I've made a ticket system 10:08.440 --> 10:12.720 to manage my blog and feature request for my project 10:12.720 --> 10:15.400 with the PAPSAB implementation. 10:15.400 --> 10:21.160 And if tomorrow, I want to make a gateway to GitHub, 10:21.160 --> 10:26.080 I can have my any script that I use with that, which will automatically 10:26.080 --> 10:32.560 work with issue on any GitHub project. 10:32.560 --> 10:36.160 Jingle is one you want to send a lot of data, 10:36.160 --> 10:37.960 and you want to have a direct connection. 10:37.960 --> 10:41.240 So it does a peer-to-peer connection whenever possible. 10:41.240 --> 10:45.960 If it's not possible, there is assistance for the server. 10:45.960 --> 10:47.720 It's useful when you want a direct connection 10:47.720 --> 10:51.680 and you have all the time network, and you want to open a port 10:51.680 --> 10:54.840 or throw us a fire wall or stuff like that. 10:54.840 --> 10:59.080 And it's good for many things that need a lot of data, 10:59.080 --> 11:00.200 and bonwise, and speed. 11:00.200 --> 11:02.800 And if you want to bypass the server, 11:02.800 --> 11:05.920 because you just need direct connection. 11:05.920 --> 11:09.080 And the gateway, so have we seen with chat example, 11:09.080 --> 11:13.280 it's really useful to communicate to some party protocol. 11:13.280 --> 11:15.200 And it's important to not that get ways 11:15.200 --> 11:17.000 are not only for start messaging. 11:17.000 --> 11:19.560 You can have gateway for FTP, for file sharing, 11:19.560 --> 11:21.680 you can have gateway for web dev, 11:21.680 --> 11:23.880 have method gateway for activity pub, 11:23.880 --> 11:25.320 for blogging, et cetera. 11:25.320 --> 11:29.200 So it's what you're generating. 11:29.200 --> 11:31.800 Some people say that I don't like XMPP, 11:31.800 --> 11:37.080 so the most of you, for answer, is you don't need to know 11:37.080 --> 11:39.920 to make an engine to drive a car. 11:39.920 --> 11:43.280 Actually, only need to make XMPP if you want to write 11:43.280 --> 11:46.960 a specification or to implement them in a way 11:46.960 --> 11:50.840 that you're developing in a library or in a client 11:50.840 --> 11:53.960 in this case, you deal with XMPP, but if you want 11:53.960 --> 11:56.960 to use XMPP as a layer to other things, 11:56.960 --> 12:02.400 you can just use software, which already deals XMPP, 12:02.400 --> 12:04.960 with XMPP for you. 12:04.960 --> 12:07.280 And there are a lot of software you can use. 12:07.280 --> 12:12.600 Flex XMPP, for instance, is a popular Python module 12:12.600 --> 12:15.440 to deal with XMPP. 12:15.440 --> 12:16.920 So if you want to make a comment, 12:16.920 --> 12:21.560 just a few lines of Python, you don't have to deal with XMPP. 12:21.560 --> 12:23.760 I've mentioned cross-soddy, because cross-soddy 12:23.760 --> 12:25.000 is far off some gateways. 12:25.000 --> 12:26.720 I use a gateway to empty-titi. 12:26.720 --> 12:30.040 So if you want to work with IoT, 12:30.040 --> 12:34.080 it's translate empty-titi to PAPSEB. 12:34.080 --> 12:35.920 So you just have to deal with that. 12:35.920 --> 12:38.800 Librarially, it's a common interface 12:38.800 --> 12:40.560 of the software I'm working on. 12:40.560 --> 12:44.720 And it has an internal JSON, 12:44.720 --> 12:47.640 a representation of 12, so if you want to work with Ticket, 12:47.640 --> 12:53.640 for instance, you will get a JSON of the metadata of your Ticket. 12:53.640 --> 12:56.680 So to conclude this talk, XMPP is great. 12:56.680 --> 12:58.200 It's not a lot for you. 12:58.200 --> 13:00.080 It's not only for instant messaging. 13:00.080 --> 13:03.440 There is a good story of the Quart compatibility, 13:03.440 --> 13:04.560 and we try to make that. 13:04.560 --> 13:06.120 And one is incompatibility. 13:06.120 --> 13:09.600 Some time, fix on the server itself, 13:09.600 --> 13:12.480 so you don't have to change anything on your side. 13:12.480 --> 13:15.400 You've already have a really active community. 13:15.400 --> 13:17.640 We were around 30 people at the same age, 13:17.640 --> 13:23.280 and it's only a few people who make the way to Brussels. 13:23.280 --> 13:25.560 So you can check the list of examples 13:25.560 --> 13:27.480 to see the feature that I implemented, 13:27.480 --> 13:29.520 and what you can do. 13:29.520 --> 13:31.480 So it's something you should consider 13:31.480 --> 13:33.160 if you want to express or anything, 13:33.160 --> 13:35.200 not necessarily instant messaging, 13:35.200 --> 13:37.040 but for anything you want, it's something 13:37.040 --> 13:39.720 which is really useful to have. 13:40.680 --> 13:43.280 That's it, Francis Torch. 13:43.280 --> 13:46.920 You can check the project on this XMPP chatroom. 13:46.920 --> 13:50.080 I am on MasterDone, so you can follow me, 13:50.080 --> 13:51.560 and if you have any questions, 13:51.560 --> 13:54.120 this is a website of my project on my blog. 13:54.120 --> 13:56.400 Thank you very much, and see you on the next question. 13:56.400 --> 13:57.400 Thank you. 13:57.400 --> 13:58.400 Thank you. 13:58.400 --> 13:59.400 Thank you. 13:59.400 --> 14:00.400 Thank you. 14:00.400 --> 14:01.400 Thank you. 14:01.400 --> 14:02.400 Thank you. 14:02.400 --> 14:03.400 Thank you. 14:03.400 --> 14:04.400 Thank you. 14:04.400 --> 14:05.400 Thank you. 14:05.800 --> 14:08.640 So I was using XMPP, actually, 14:08.640 --> 14:11.240 each other, the E4 quite a while with friends, 14:11.240 --> 14:12.720 professionally, my professional, 14:12.720 --> 14:13.960 so we all had our animals, 14:13.960 --> 14:16.600 Federation, I was expecting, I loved it. 14:16.600 --> 14:20.800 But with a real business customer's mind, 14:20.800 --> 14:22.840 I had big issues. 14:22.840 --> 14:24.680 Not with the product called Excel, 14:24.680 --> 14:25.920 but with the clients. 14:29.120 --> 14:31.560 It's at the only, really, really good, 14:31.560 --> 14:33.880 three XMPP clients, 14:33.880 --> 14:36.600 I had conversations for Android, 14:36.600 --> 14:39.200 iOS, there wasn't, it was last time, 14:39.200 --> 14:45.840 I put it on the 60s, 17, when I had the evaluate for iOS. 14:45.840 --> 14:47.400 There was not much around, 14:47.400 --> 14:52.640 and the best thing was the Chitzi account. 14:52.640 --> 14:54.960 But then there was one models, 14:54.960 --> 14:57.800 and there was, there was two different standards 14:57.800 --> 15:01.400 for this MasterDone type, the old and the new thing, I guess. 15:02.360 --> 15:04.640 Yes, it's man, man for the arcade. 15:04.640 --> 15:09.240 Yeah, the product called itself is fine. 15:09.240 --> 15:14.240 But it's very hard to implement it as a customer, 15:14.240 --> 15:21.240 because if they want to have mobile, web-based, 15:21.880 --> 15:26.880 kind, and on desktop, your six, yes, the right job. 15:26.880 --> 15:29.840 Oh, that's a different project we tried to, 15:29.840 --> 15:31.800 but you're on the Instantness of InCase. 15:31.800 --> 15:33.880 My talk is to use it in more general case, 15:33.880 --> 15:37.200 but if you, if we stick with the Instantness of InCase, 15:37.200 --> 15:39.080 we have software, like Snicket, 15:39.080 --> 15:44.080 which try to do software for every major platform 15:44.080 --> 15:48.680 with a brand name, Unic, brand name, everywhere. 15:48.680 --> 15:51.160 It's working quite well. 15:51.160 --> 15:53.520 There is moving, which is a web client, 15:53.520 --> 15:59.160 but it's using, I think it's still working on Android, 15:59.160 --> 16:02.480 and iOS 2, but I'm not sure, it's need to be checked. 16:07.480 --> 16:10.440 Yes, yes, it's behind us, make it. 16:10.440 --> 16:14.440 Which is, I guess, sweet, or he writes in server, 16:14.440 --> 16:16.440 they took conversations and branded it, 16:16.440 --> 16:19.000 and I think there's not a client brand, which as well. 16:19.000 --> 16:20.680 So, okay, that's interesting. 16:20.680 --> 16:23.800 It's good to hear, because I had this thing, 16:23.800 --> 16:26.440 to work at the 17th of the variation for pick-up, 16:26.440 --> 16:31.440 and the most dishonest, not XMP screen, it's totally great. 16:31.720 --> 16:33.560 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 16:33.560 --> 16:37.680 The process is not able to hire a web developer, 16:37.680 --> 16:38.880 each other is great. 16:40.880 --> 16:45.400 Yeah, I'm seeing, I've improved a lot of stuff on the distance. 16:45.400 --> 16:48.920 There is Dino, there is a gadget, which I've improved the UI. 16:48.920 --> 16:52.240 I'm working also on a new desktop content. 16:52.240 --> 16:56.480 IOS, C-Scene, and Monal, I've improved a lot of stuff. 16:56.480 --> 17:00.000 I'm not using iOS, but I know that it's very difficult 17:00.000 --> 17:02.480 platform to work with, I think, 17:02.480 --> 17:04.800 especially for notification, but Singapore 17:04.800 --> 17:07.240 improved a lot the last few years, 17:07.240 --> 17:10.440 and you'd full check the modern state of XMPP. 17:10.440 --> 17:13.960 It's not like it was 10 years ago, it's really more modern. 17:13.960 --> 17:17.280 That's still for you issue, but everywhere there are issue 17:17.280 --> 17:18.120 anyways.