WEBVTT 00:00.000 --> 00:23.000 Hello, this is Jessel from Private Ownership to Open Governance. 00:23.000 --> 00:29.900 So first, Huawei, I'm Leo, soft engineer Dino working on Jessel, particularly 00:29.900 --> 00:32.900 the dog generation aspect. 00:32.900 --> 00:33.900 Yeah, I'm Luca. 00:33.900 --> 00:34.900 I also work Dino. 00:34.900 --> 00:39.900 I also do standards work on TC309, so on JavaScript itself. 00:39.900 --> 00:44.900 And I work on various aspects, various web specs, like fetch. 00:44.900 --> 00:47.900 Yeah. 00:47.900 --> 00:49.900 So first off, what does Jessel say? 00:49.900 --> 00:54.900 I mean, how many people here know what Jessel is? 00:54.900 --> 00:56.900 A fair amount of what's there about a third? 00:56.900 --> 00:59.900 How many people have used Jessel? 00:59.900 --> 01:01.900 Half of that, okay, fair enough. 01:01.900 --> 01:04.900 So Jessel is our modern JavaScript registry. 01:04.900 --> 01:08.900 So similar to MPM, for example, that supports TypeScript after box. 01:08.900 --> 01:11.900 So you don't need to transpile to JavaScript first. 01:11.900 --> 01:13.900 You can just upload TypeScript directly. 01:13.900 --> 01:17.900 And consumers of those packages can just import without problem. 01:17.900 --> 01:21.900 But it does not replace MPM, it lives alongside it. 01:21.900 --> 01:26.900 So you can, for example, use MPM dependencies in your Jessel packages. 01:26.900 --> 01:31.900 And if works across different run times, be it Dino, no Jess, bun, 01:31.900 --> 01:35.900 Cloud for workers, you name it. 01:35.900 --> 01:40.900 As long as it supports Package Jason and no modules folder. 01:40.900 --> 01:42.900 And yes, M. 01:42.900 --> 01:43.900 And yes, M. 01:43.900 --> 01:44.900 And yes, M. 01:44.900 --> 01:47.900 Yeah, because that's all the thing. 01:47.900 --> 01:49.900 Yes, M is required in Jessel. 01:49.900 --> 01:51.900 You cannot use CJS. 01:51.900 --> 01:53.900 We don't like it. 01:53.900 --> 01:59.900 So, and it's completely open source in free. 01:59.900 --> 02:01.900 So it's not like MPM that's close source. 02:01.900 --> 02:04.900 It has like a pay tier if you want to do private packages. 02:04.900 --> 02:07.900 It's completely open source in free. 02:07.900 --> 02:10.900 And so why? 02:10.900 --> 02:12.900 Well, complexity. 02:12.900 --> 02:14.900 Poplishing to MPM is too complex. 02:14.900 --> 02:18.900 I mean, as mentioned earlier, TypeScript just works with MPM. 02:18.900 --> 02:22.900 You first have conference pilot generated DTS files, et cetera. 02:22.900 --> 02:24.900 And it's just not a clean process. 02:24.900 --> 02:27.900 And in terms of just setting that up, it's hours of work. 02:27.900 --> 02:28.900 Yeah. 02:28.900 --> 02:29.900 So you're export maps. 02:29.900 --> 02:30.900 You're like dependencies. 02:30.900 --> 02:32.900 You know, the difference between dependencies, peer dependencies, 02:32.900 --> 02:35.900 optional dependencies, optional peer dependencies, like all these things. 02:35.900 --> 02:37.900 No, you don't want to know. 02:37.900 --> 02:38.900 Yeah. 02:38.900 --> 02:39.900 And innovation. 02:39.900 --> 02:43.900 Well, MPM really hasn't changed anything in the past years. 02:43.900 --> 02:45.900 They don't add new features. 02:45.900 --> 02:50.900 They don't really interact much with the community. 02:50.900 --> 02:54.900 So that's why we want to change that. 02:54.900 --> 02:57.900 And we have a quick question to the audience. 02:57.900 --> 03:02.900 Like who of you knows what the last feature is that MPM shipped? 03:02.900 --> 03:03.900 Raise your hand. 03:03.900 --> 03:04.900 Go ahead. 03:04.900 --> 03:06.900 Work spaces? 03:06.900 --> 03:07.900 Good guess. 03:07.900 --> 03:09.900 I mean, it's like about that age. 03:09.900 --> 03:11.900 It's the little like blue TypeScript icon. 03:11.900 --> 03:14.900 At the top left of the package that tells you whether a package has types. 03:14.900 --> 03:16.900 That was like three years ago. 03:16.900 --> 03:19.900 So. 03:19.900 --> 03:20.900 And yeah. 03:20.900 --> 03:23.900 I mean, we all know like the JavaScript ecosystem. 03:23.900 --> 03:25.900 Oh, and you framework every day. 03:25.900 --> 03:27.900 Well, so it's really, really fast. 03:27.900 --> 03:31.900 But MPM is just holding back or not changing anything. 03:31.900 --> 03:34.900 So yeah, we want to address that. 03:34.900 --> 03:38.900 And well, our values, which unlike MPM is owned by Microsoft, 03:39.900 --> 03:41.900 so it's completely open. 03:41.900 --> 03:47.900 And so yeah, open source community and open governance are the core principles. 03:47.900 --> 03:51.900 Again, we, for example, having the case of MPM, 03:51.900 --> 03:55.900 it's just it's known that they don't really interact with the community. 03:55.900 --> 03:59.900 They don't really care about issues in the community. 03:59.900 --> 04:03.900 Like let's say there's a package that someone else should have, 04:03.900 --> 04:05.900 but they don't transfer it. 04:05.900 --> 04:08.900 There's been problems like that all over the place with MPM. 04:08.900 --> 04:11.900 So these are things that we also try to address. 04:11.900 --> 04:14.900 So I guess it's time of time. 04:14.900 --> 04:15.900 Yeah. 04:15.900 --> 04:18.900 I guess like better than us explaining it is just show you how it works. 04:18.900 --> 04:20.900 So this is the JSON website. 04:20.900 --> 04:22.900 JSON radio to start publishing a package. 04:22.900 --> 04:23.900 You go here. 04:23.900 --> 04:24.900 You sign in. 04:24.900 --> 04:25.900 And you click publisher package. 04:25.900 --> 04:26.900 I'm already signed in. 04:26.900 --> 04:28.900 So I'm just going to go to a published package. 04:28.900 --> 04:31.900 So this one interesting thing about JSON. 04:31.900 --> 04:34.900 So unlike MPM, which has these top level packages, 04:34.900 --> 04:35.900 that everybody can sort of squat. 04:35.900 --> 04:36.900 JSON doesn't have this. 04:36.900 --> 04:38.900 It JSON every package isn't a scope. 04:38.900 --> 04:40.900 And you're limited with a number of scopes. 04:40.900 --> 04:41.900 You can register. 04:41.900 --> 04:43.900 So you can't like just register in the entire world. 04:43.900 --> 04:46.900 And then get people to pay you to release those packages. 04:46.900 --> 04:47.900 Right? 04:47.900 --> 04:49.900 Like you cannot squat packages on JSON. 04:49.900 --> 04:50.900 It's explicitly against our policy. 04:50.900 --> 04:52.900 And if you do see someone do it. 04:52.900 --> 04:53.900 Tell us. 04:53.900 --> 04:55.900 Well, we'll fix it. 04:55.900 --> 04:58.900 So I'm not going to create a new scope because I already have one. 04:58.900 --> 05:00.900 But usually you can just click here and create one. 05:00.900 --> 05:03.900 But I'm going to select an existing demos scope. 05:03.900 --> 05:08.900 And I'll call it foster 2025. 05:08.900 --> 05:09.900 Yes. 05:09.900 --> 05:10.900 So we'll create the package. 05:10.900 --> 05:13.900 What this will do is it will just like tell JSON. 05:13.900 --> 05:14.900 Hey, I'm about to publish this package. 05:14.900 --> 05:17.900 It'll give you some instructions for how to do it. 05:17.900 --> 05:21.900 So you're going to get this little JSON file that just contains 05:21.900 --> 05:23.900 the package name, the conversion of the package. 05:23.900 --> 05:26.900 What license it is, and then an export field. 05:26.900 --> 05:29.900 And the export field is not the same export field that you have in package 05:29.900 --> 05:30.900 that's much simpler. 05:30.900 --> 05:32.900 It does not support conditional exports. 05:32.900 --> 05:33.900 You don't have to specify types in there. 05:33.900 --> 05:35.900 You don't have to specify seed JS versus ESM. 05:35.900 --> 05:38.900 All of these things, because JSON supports ESM. 05:38.900 --> 05:41.900 And you can publish types out of the box. 05:41.900 --> 05:45.900 So yeah, this is the short-hand syntax where we're just exporting mod.ts. 05:45.900 --> 05:50.900 Leo's going to copy that into a repository. 05:50.900 --> 05:52.900 So I have an empty directory here. 05:52.900 --> 05:55.900 I'm just going to create a JSON. 05:55.900 --> 06:04.900 And then we're going to just create a index. 06:04.900 --> 06:05.900 Or what is it? 06:05.900 --> 06:07.900 Mod.ts file. 06:07.900 --> 06:08.900 No package JSON. 06:08.900 --> 06:10.900 No TypeScript configuration. 06:10.900 --> 06:11.900 Nothing. 06:11.900 --> 06:12.900 Just a TypeScript file. 06:12.900 --> 06:13.900 And start exporting something. 06:13.900 --> 06:15.900 So let's write like a simple function. 06:15.900 --> 06:17.900 I don't know adding numbers, I guess. 06:17.900 --> 06:19.900 That's a good example. 06:19.900 --> 06:23.900 We're going to take two arguments, A and B, return, A plus B. 06:23.900 --> 06:24.900 And this is TypeScript. 06:24.900 --> 06:27.900 So we can actually annotate this with types. 06:27.900 --> 06:30.900 So you can do A is a number. 06:30.900 --> 06:32.900 He is a number. 06:32.900 --> 06:33.900 Returns a number. 06:33.900 --> 06:34.900 I know. 06:34.900 --> 06:36.900 Crazy, right? 06:36.900 --> 06:38.900 And then let's also add some docs. 06:38.900 --> 06:42.900 Because JSON can actually generate documentation automatically from your code. 06:42.900 --> 06:45.900 And for this, we're just going to use the regular JSON docs syntax. 06:45.900 --> 06:48.900 Yeah, I guess what does this function do add two numbers. 06:48.900 --> 06:52.900 Yeah, at least. 06:52.900 --> 06:55.900 This is the most popular package tomorrow. 06:55.900 --> 06:56.900 I don't know. 06:56.900 --> 07:00.900 We're going to go really all out documenting this year. 07:00.900 --> 07:01.900 Yes. 07:01.900 --> 07:02.900 Cool. 07:02.900 --> 07:04.900 So yeah, that's about it. 07:04.900 --> 07:07.900 So we have a package now. 07:07.900 --> 07:09.900 Let's publish it. 07:09.900 --> 07:12.900 So to publish it, you can either use the JSON RCLI. 07:12.900 --> 07:14.900 You can use that through. 07:14.900 --> 07:16.900 And actually, can you go back to the JSON website? 07:16.900 --> 07:19.900 You can either publish with npxjs or publish. 07:20.900 --> 07:23.900 Or whatever your favorite package manager is, or you can use, you know, publish. 07:23.900 --> 07:25.900 It's built right into Dino. 07:25.900 --> 07:27.900 I'm using your Dino installed. 07:27.900 --> 07:28.900 You're considering you work there. 07:28.900 --> 07:30.900 So maybe use Dino publish. 07:30.900 --> 07:33.900 It's exactly the same thing. 07:33.900 --> 07:35.900 So let's do that. 07:35.900 --> 07:39.900 You know, publish. 07:39.900 --> 07:42.900 And then here's another interesting thing you're going to see. 07:42.900 --> 07:45.900 JSON does not have tokens. 07:46.900 --> 07:50.900 That process to your local machine, because there's a lot of security vulnerabilities that come with that. 07:50.900 --> 07:52.900 Namely, people can steal those tokens. 07:52.900 --> 07:58.900 So when you publish locally, you actually interactively authorize publishing by clicking the link in the CLI. 07:58.900 --> 07:59.900 It sends it to the website. 07:59.900 --> 08:00.900 You click on approve. 08:00.900 --> 08:02.900 And then it publishes. 08:02.900 --> 08:07.900 And that way, we can make use of two factor authentication and all that kind of thing. 08:07.900 --> 08:08.900 So now it's going to publish. 08:08.900 --> 08:09.900 We're going to wait here for a second. 08:09.900 --> 08:10.900 That was pretty fast. 08:10.900 --> 08:12.900 And the package is published to JSON. 08:12.900 --> 08:14.900 Okay, you can all see it now. 08:14.900 --> 08:17.900 JSON.io slash at demo slash, fast in 2025. 08:17.900 --> 08:18.900 No, Docs don't. 08:18.900 --> 08:19.900 We don't have a read me. 08:19.900 --> 08:22.900 And we don't have any documentation in the index of the module itself. 08:22.900 --> 08:26.900 But we can look at the documentation for the ad function. 08:26.900 --> 08:30.900 So if you hit the Docs tab, you'll immediately see these are all the exports from the module. 08:30.900 --> 08:33.900 You see the documentation here that. 08:33.900 --> 08:34.900 Leo wrote. 08:34.900 --> 08:38.900 And if you click on the ad function, you'll see the parameters obviously the return type. 08:38.900 --> 08:42.900 And then all the documentation that we wrote for those parameters. 08:42.900 --> 08:44.900 Obviously, for an ad function, not so important. 08:44.900 --> 08:48.900 But as you can imagine, this gets very useful if you have large packages. 08:48.900 --> 08:52.900 And then on the right there, you can see how to import these packages. 08:52.900 --> 08:55.900 So you can use this with all kinds of different things. 08:55.900 --> 08:57.900 With Dino and PM, yarn, PM, bun. 08:57.900 --> 08:59.900 We remember what option you chose there. 08:59.900 --> 09:01.900 So if you, like, often use bun. 09:01.900 --> 09:04.900 For example, you can select that while we show you the bun instructions. 09:05.900 --> 09:08.900 But yeah, so what we're going to do now is just demonstrate that this is actually working. 09:08.900 --> 09:10.900 You're just going to copy that second thing right there. 09:10.900 --> 09:12.900 This doesn't actually require an installation step. 09:12.900 --> 09:14.900 If you know it just works out of the box. 09:14.900 --> 09:17.900 And I think you're just going to start a repule. 09:17.900 --> 09:21.900 And import directly from this ad function. 09:21.900 --> 09:22.900 I'm just sorry. 09:22.900 --> 09:23.900 I'll download it. 09:23.900 --> 09:26.900 You can have an ad function and let's hope it works. 09:26.900 --> 09:27.900 It does. 09:27.900 --> 09:28.900 Woo! 09:28.900 --> 09:29.900 We can add numbers. 09:29.900 --> 09:34.900 Cool. 09:34.900 --> 09:35.900 Yeah. 09:35.900 --> 09:37.900 So that's publishing. 09:37.900 --> 09:41.900 If we have time at the end also you have the publishing or how to consume this in 09:41.900 --> 09:42.900 MPM. 09:42.900 --> 09:46.900 But the other really cool thing about JSR is that we score your package with some automatic metrics. 09:46.900 --> 09:50.900 And you can use this to sort of judge from the search for example, 09:50.900 --> 09:55.900 whether a package is like really something you want to be using. 09:55.900 --> 09:58.900 For example, doesn't have documentation. 09:58.900 --> 09:59.900 Does it have a description? 09:59.900 --> 10:02.900 Does it mark which run times it uses all these things? 10:02.900 --> 10:03.900 Score is currently 58. 10:03.900 --> 10:04.900 We can improve this. 10:04.900 --> 10:05.900 We don't have time though. 10:05.900 --> 10:08.900 So we'll do this some other time. 10:08.900 --> 10:12.900 This is probably going to impede us to being the number one package tomorrow. 10:12.900 --> 10:13.900 But oh well. 10:13.900 --> 10:14.900 Cool. 10:14.900 --> 10:16.900 So let's move on to some other features. 10:16.900 --> 10:17.900 Yeah. 10:17.900 --> 10:18.900 Token was publishing. 10:18.900 --> 10:19.900 I mentioned that before. 10:19.900 --> 10:21.900 But actually we also do this from CI. 10:21.900 --> 10:27.900 So you can publish directly from your CI machine without having to set up any tokens in that CI machine. 10:27.900 --> 10:30.900 For example, on GitHub actions, there's OIDC tokens. 10:30.900 --> 10:34.900 These are sort of a standard authentication mechanism coming from CI 10:34.900 --> 10:38.900 Avengers that allows you to publish without having to configure any static tokens. 10:38.900 --> 10:39.900 They can be leaked. 10:39.900 --> 10:41.900 In JSR, you can just specify this is to get a repository. 10:41.900 --> 10:43.900 I'm going to be publishing from. 10:43.900 --> 10:46.900 And then add, you know, publish or JSR publish to your GitHub actions and 10:46.900 --> 10:47.900 it just works. 10:47.900 --> 10:49.900 You don't have to set up anything else. 10:49.900 --> 10:50.900 Score provenance. 10:50.900 --> 10:56.900 So when you publish, we publish a sort of manifest that describes what you've 10:56.900 --> 11:05.900 published from where with what hash is into a public registry. 11:05.900 --> 11:07.900 That is type of proof. 11:07.900 --> 11:12.900 So you can actually see that any given package who was published by when it was 11:12.900 --> 11:15.900 published where it was published from what repository it was published. 11:15.900 --> 11:21.900 So you can sort of follow the supply chain to make sure that not some random person is 11:21.900 --> 11:24.900 publishing something that they shouldn't have been. 11:24.900 --> 11:27.900 And then the documentation generation, you saw that a second ago. 11:27.900 --> 11:28.900 Yeah. 11:28.900 --> 11:31.900 I mean, we just generate documentation for all the typeings and functions that you 11:31.900 --> 11:35.900 export and try to make it as good looking as possible. 11:35.900 --> 11:39.900 But now, the actual thing that the name of the title of the focus 11:39.900 --> 11:41.900 governance. 11:41.900 --> 11:42.900 Yeah. 11:42.900 --> 11:48.900 So obviously, we cannot compete with NPM on the thing of open governance 11:48.900 --> 11:50.900 if we don't have an open governance structure. 11:50.900 --> 11:51.900 And so far, we haven't. 11:51.900 --> 11:54.900 So far, JSR has been completely open source. 11:54.900 --> 11:56.900 It's been like source. 11:56.900 --> 12:01.900 This source has been available and we've been taking PRs from contributors. 12:01.900 --> 12:06.900 And again, for both the backend, the CLI and sort of anything that is touched 12:06.900 --> 12:07.900 by that. 12:07.900 --> 12:12.900 But we now want to expand to actually have an open governance where we have 12:12.900 --> 12:16.900 member, we have a board, a governance board, consisting of members from all kinds of 12:16.900 --> 12:19.900 different companies in the JavaScript ecosystem that can control this without any 12:19.900 --> 12:24.900 specific company having, like, undo influence over the project. 12:24.900 --> 12:27.900 So yeah, why do we want to do this? 12:27.900 --> 12:31.900 We don't, like, JavaScript itself is not controlled by a single company, right? 12:31.900 --> 12:35.900 JavaScript is standardized in T339 in a standards group with many different 12:35.900 --> 12:39.900 companies, all the browser vendors, many stakeholders of 12:39.900 --> 12:41.900 JavaScript. 12:41.900 --> 12:45.900 And we don't really want the registry that JavaScript 12:45.900 --> 12:47.900 is used to be any different from that. 12:47.900 --> 12:51.900 It should be controlled, not by one company, but by a group. 12:51.900 --> 12:54.900 JavaScript implementations are also open source, like, 12:54.900 --> 12:59.900 V8, JavaScript core, spider monkey, these are all open source. 12:59.900 --> 13:01.900 So why shouldn't the registry be open source too? 13:01.900 --> 13:05.900 And we've seen in the past that NPM being closed source is very 13:05.900 --> 13:06.900 unfortunate. 13:06.900 --> 13:10.900 It means there's no way for the community to force innovation other than 13:10.900 --> 13:13.900 in package managers, we've seen this in package managers like when 13:13.900 --> 13:17.900 the yarn came out NPM, the CLI got a lot better because 13:17.900 --> 13:21.900 GitHub was forced to do something, but there has been no competition in the 13:21.900 --> 13:23.900 actual registry space itself, so like the back end. 13:23.900 --> 13:27.900 So GitHub hasn't been forced to innovate there. 13:27.900 --> 13:31.900 Yeah, so JavaScript needs to be a source covered by the community and open 13:31.900 --> 13:32.900 to innovation. 13:32.900 --> 13:34.900 So the board members. 13:34.900 --> 13:35.900 Evan, you? 13:35.900 --> 13:36.900 Isaac Fluter? 13:36.900 --> 13:37.900 James Snell? 13:37.900 --> 13:38.900 This guy? 13:38.900 --> 13:40.900 And Brian Del. 13:40.900 --> 13:44.900 Yeah, Evan, you are the creator of V and of you. 13:44.900 --> 13:45.900 You may know him. 13:45.900 --> 13:49.900 He is currently starting a new startup called Voy0. 13:49.900 --> 13:52.900 Isaac Fluter, the original creator of NPM. 13:52.900 --> 13:56.900 Now, co-founder of Volt, which is a package manager, 13:56.900 --> 13:58.900 tool for NPM. 13:58.900 --> 14:01.900 That's not quite launched yet, but it's getting their 14:01.900 --> 14:03.900 James Snell and Node.js, TSE members. 14:03.900 --> 14:05.900 So this is the technical steering committee of Node.js. 14:05.900 --> 14:07.900 And he's a principal engineer at CloudFlare. 14:07.900 --> 14:09.900 Me already told you who I am. 14:09.900 --> 14:12.900 And then Ryan Del, who is the original creator of Node.js, 14:12.900 --> 14:16.900 and also the creator of you. 14:16.900 --> 14:18.900 So what does this board actually do? 14:18.900 --> 14:22.900 We oversee the thing that we want to do is move 14:22.900 --> 14:26.900 JSR through a foundation, a foundation being something like 14:26.900 --> 14:30.900 the Linux foundation or something like that. 14:30.900 --> 14:32.900 And the board is going to figure out how this works. 14:32.900 --> 14:35.900 So how this works in practice, obviously, but also figuring out 14:35.900 --> 14:38.900 whether we need to split up our own foundation or whether we can move 14:38.900 --> 14:40.900 to an existing foundation, like the Linux foundation, 14:40.900 --> 14:46.900 or the, or, yeah, Open.js, for example, 14:46.900 --> 14:49.900 we will set the general direction of the project. 14:49.900 --> 14:52.900 This is not like the day-to-day operations of like, 14:52.900 --> 14:55.900 what PR gets merged and what PR doesn't, but it's more like, 14:55.900 --> 14:57.900 this is the direction we want to go. 14:57.900 --> 14:59.900 So like, we don't want to support Common.js because of 14:59.900 --> 15:01.900 these reasons. 15:01.900 --> 15:04.900 Or maybe in the future, there's some new dialect of 15:04.900 --> 15:07.900 JavaScript like TypeScript that we may want to support. 15:07.900 --> 15:10.900 The board is the group that will decide this. 15:10.900 --> 15:13.900 Yeah, the second thing is sort of that same. 15:13.900 --> 15:16.900 We will obviously determine how the governance board evolves 15:16.900 --> 15:18.900 and moving forward, like whether we need to add more members, 15:18.900 --> 15:22.900 whether there's members that I don't know what to leave. 15:22.900 --> 15:24.900 We will also establish a moderation group. 15:24.900 --> 15:28.900 So another part of the problems with NPM is the fact that 15:28.900 --> 15:32.900 moderation happens by GitHub and by Microsoft sort of with their own 15:32.900 --> 15:34.900 policies that are not really public. 15:34.900 --> 15:37.900 And it's very arbitrary, honestly. 15:37.900 --> 15:40.900 And we will establish an open moderation group that anybody 15:40.900 --> 15:44.900 from the community can join will be like voted into the group. 15:44.900 --> 15:47.900 And they will determine what the moderation policy is, 15:47.900 --> 15:49.900 and actually enforce the moderation. 15:49.900 --> 15:52.900 So determining, for example, whether a package is actually squatting 15:52.900 --> 15:55.900 or not, whether a package should be moved from one owner 15:55.900 --> 15:59.900 to another because it is on maintain, things like that. 15:59.900 --> 16:02.900 And then we will figure out how to actually do the day-to-day 16:02.900 --> 16:05.900 of reviewing contributions to the project, 16:05.900 --> 16:08.900 and then obviously how to do funding. 16:08.900 --> 16:10.900 This is a very big question. 16:10.900 --> 16:15.900 How do you publicly host what is effectively content delivery network 16:15.900 --> 16:17.900 in an open source context, right? 16:17.900 --> 16:21.900 This is like, you're having people download very large pieces 16:21.900 --> 16:23.900 of code, essentially, from the internet. 16:23.900 --> 16:25.900 Somebody has to pay for this. 16:25.900 --> 16:27.900 And how exactly this works, we don't know. 16:27.900 --> 16:30.900 Dino is in a state right now where we can absolutely pay for this, 16:30.900 --> 16:33.900 and we are going to, and we're willing to. 16:33.900 --> 16:37.900 But in the future, we will have to figure out whether this involves 16:37.900 --> 16:39.900 other companies, also sponsoring JSR, 16:39.900 --> 16:43.900 whether this involves us working with CDN vendors, 16:43.900 --> 16:46.900 like CloudFlayer or Fastly to pay for bandwidth, 16:46.900 --> 16:49.900 or whether this is something else entirely that we could do. 16:49.900 --> 16:53.900 And we would be very interested to hear your thoughts on this. 16:53.900 --> 16:56.900 Dr. Clarify on that, we also had a first meeting, 16:56.900 --> 17:00.900 and just to quickly skip to one point is that there is 17:00.900 --> 17:04.900 the discussion of operation cost, which we reviewed, 17:04.900 --> 17:07.900 and networking being a notable expense, as Luca just mentioned. 17:07.900 --> 17:09.900 And it was an interest from exploring cash and solution, 17:09.900 --> 17:13.900 and CloudFlayer potentially supporting to help mitigate the cost. 17:13.900 --> 17:17.900 So technically, we already potentially have CloudFlayer taking that over. 17:17.900 --> 17:19.900 And then there was discussion about moving JSR, 17:19.900 --> 17:23.900 to an open structure, just to make sure that it's actually independent, 17:23.900 --> 17:27.900 and not just run by Dino, like it is currently. 17:27.900 --> 17:29.900 Adoption trends were shared internally, 17:29.900 --> 17:32.900 the need for better tracking of active usage, 17:32.900 --> 17:35.900 and download metrics were noted, 17:35.900 --> 17:38.900 and technical challenges were discussed. 17:38.900 --> 17:42.900 Like meta-interability with MPM, being able to self-host, 17:42.900 --> 17:47.900 having private packages, improved package manager support, 17:47.900 --> 17:52.900 so being able to have better integration with the likes of MPM, 17:52.900 --> 17:54.900 yarn, et cetera. 17:54.900 --> 17:59.900 And enabling direct H2PS imports, which has been a relatively popular request, 17:59.900 --> 18:03.900 being able to just import a JSR package in the browser we H2PS URL, 18:03.900 --> 18:06.900 but that obviously opens the big concern of cost, 18:06.900 --> 18:10.900 because then you're just turning into just the liver, 18:10.900 --> 18:12.900 and that's not cheap. 18:12.900 --> 18:16.900 Yeah. 18:16.900 --> 18:21.900 So, any questions? 18:21.900 --> 18:31.900 Yeah. 18:31.900 --> 18:35.900 Yeah. 18:35.900 --> 18:39.900 I certainly commend tenor of open source project. 18:39.900 --> 18:42.900 What is my strategy if I want to support JSR, 18:42.900 --> 18:45.900 like, but I still want to help MPM users, 18:45.900 --> 18:48.900 to support it to the boss platform, 18:48.900 --> 18:53.900 or like, this is a easy way to, from not users to use. 18:53.900 --> 18:59.900 Ah, just like, what do you suggest for my intelligence of open source projects? 18:59.900 --> 19:01.900 Very happy you asked this question. 19:01.900 --> 19:03.900 Do you want to do the demo of importing from MPM? 19:03.900 --> 19:04.900 Sure. 19:04.900 --> 19:05.900 If it works. 19:05.900 --> 19:08.900 The demo is here that we apparently have time for. 19:08.900 --> 19:10.900 So, it's a great question. 19:10.900 --> 19:11.900 Like, if you have an existing package, 19:11.900 --> 19:14.900 that maybe is already a public MPM, how do you publish that to JSR? 19:14.900 --> 19:16.900 So, you have two solutions. 19:16.900 --> 19:19.900 Either you do a publish to both MPM and JSR. 19:19.900 --> 19:20.900 You can do that. 19:20.900 --> 19:21.900 That's perfectly reasonable. 19:21.900 --> 19:24.900 But JSR actually supports people from, 19:24.900 --> 19:26.900 like, with the MPM package manager or yarn, 19:26.900 --> 19:28.900 or MPM importing your package. 19:28.900 --> 19:32.900 And if you go to the website, Leo, 19:33.900 --> 19:36.900 and we go to the site bar and click on, 19:36.900 --> 19:38.900 use with MPM. 19:38.900 --> 19:40.900 Awesome. 19:40.900 --> 19:44.900 You can actually see here this MPX JSR ad. 19:44.900 --> 19:46.900 Command. 19:46.900 --> 19:50.900 So, I can just delete the package itself. 19:50.900 --> 19:51.900 We don't need it anymore. 19:51.900 --> 19:53.900 Just noise. 19:53.900 --> 19:57.900 And I guess, do you need to create a package JSR? 19:57.900 --> 19:58.900 No, no, no. 19:58.900 --> 20:01.900 Yes. 20:01.900 --> 20:02.900 Sure. 20:02.900 --> 20:06.900 Oh. 20:06.900 --> 20:08.900 Out of one package. 20:08.900 --> 20:09.900 Yep. 20:09.900 --> 20:13.900 You can see there's a no-module folder that has the package inside. 20:13.900 --> 20:18.900 And this is sort of the MPM translation output of the package. 20:18.900 --> 20:21.900 So, if you publish any package to MPM in TypeScript, 20:21.900 --> 20:25.900 we will automatically translate two JavaScript for you for MPM users. 20:26.900 --> 20:29.900 And users can just import it using JSX and MPM, 20:29.900 --> 20:32.900 or sorry, MPX JSR, whatever. 20:32.900 --> 20:34.900 And actually, in the future, 20:34.900 --> 20:38.900 we're hoping to sort of have more native integration with package managers like MPM, 20:38.900 --> 20:42.900 so that users can just specify a JSR colon something, 20:42.900 --> 20:45.900 something in their dependencies rate in their package JSON, 20:45.900 --> 20:48.900 and just have it installed out of the box. 20:48.900 --> 20:50.900 Yeah, we'll see where that goes. 20:50.900 --> 20:52.900 Does that answer your question? 20:52.900 --> 20:53.900 Cool. 20:53.900 --> 20:54.900 Anyone else? 20:54.900 --> 20:57.900 Yes. 20:57.900 --> 20:58.900 Yes. 20:58.900 --> 20:59.900 It's fine. 20:59.900 --> 21:03.900 You can publish the package just now on JSR. 21:03.900 --> 21:05.900 Thank you very much. 21:05.900 --> 21:06.900 Yes. 21:06.900 --> 21:08.900 All right. 21:08.900 --> 21:12.900 Perfect. 21:12.900 --> 21:15.900 Anyone else? 21:15.900 --> 21:16.900 Anyone else? 21:16.900 --> 21:17.900 Anyone else? 21:17.900 --> 21:18.900 Anyone else? 21:18.900 --> 21:19.900 Anyone else? 21:19.900 --> 21:20.900 Anyone else? 21:20.900 --> 21:23.900 Publish a package suddenly? 21:23.900 --> 21:24.900 Cool. 21:24.900 --> 21:26.900 If you have any other questions, feel free to reach out to us. 21:26.900 --> 21:31.900 You can join our weekly open working group meetings and office hours. 21:31.900 --> 21:32.900 Ignore this dinner.co link. 21:32.900 --> 21:34.900 We don't have a redirect service on JSR. 21:34.900 --> 21:37.900 It's domain, but yeah, this is like an open meeting on discord, 21:37.900 --> 21:40.900 where you can join every two weeks. 21:40.900 --> 21:41.900 I think on Thursday. 21:41.900 --> 21:46.900 And yeah, you can just chat with folks using JSR. 21:46.900 --> 21:48.900 And yeah, if you want to try JSR yourself, 21:48.900 --> 21:51.900 and if you want to contribute, or just see you look at the source code. 21:51.900 --> 21:52.900 JSR. 21:52.900 --> 21:54.900 That's how you're always slash JSR on GitHub. 21:54.900 --> 21:55.900 Cool. 21:55.900 --> 21:56.900 Thank you very much.